Forum

[louis31]

Hi,

I just watched Marks latest video about the CWS which I am interested in however the sites they showed just do not add up!

They say this site earns $250 a month http://antiaginglifeextensions.com/ however there are no affiliate links on the site! Exactly the same with the third site it shows.

Also these sites posts are only from june 2010 so how have they earned that cash for months as claimed?

Hope there is an explanation.

Note from Mark: See my response and Daniel Turner's response on page 3 of this thread. In short though, their staff were moving wordpress themes for their affiliate sites and it screwed up the links and the dates on the posts. If you check the whois records those sites have been around a year or two each.

 

[bartko09]

Good catch. I checked out the first site which looked properly monetized and the dates of the posts were hidden so as not to give off a stale feeling. Not sure what the deal is with the other two examples.

 

[louis31]

It bothers me that some serious players including Mark are giving us sites with made up earnings - at least that's how it seems.

Makes you wonder what else people make up.

I've already caught out Geaorge Brown lying about one of his sites.

 

[bartko09]

Feedback on CWS.

http://www.warriorforum.com/internet-ma ... ystem.html

 

[louis31]

Thanks for that. I've sent affilorama a ticket it will be very interesting what there answer is! I'll let you know.

 

[jcdean]

I don't know about their claims of of profits, but the principle is sound, and really nothing new. Target micro niches with, optimized micro niche sites.

With a domain at $10.00US per month it's hard to lose money if you pick a product that sells, with little compitition on the serps.

The buisness model really is full proof.

None of what I just said makes it OK to make phoney claims though.

 

[louis31]

Just bugs me if its true why make false claims and show sites that are not making cash.

 

[paulie69]

I've heard from a friend that in order to generate traffic this system rather singularly promotes AMA. A couple of points here. Is it true (as I am led to believe it is) that these guys "own" AMA? Secondly, if that is so, does their system openly disclose their relationship with AMA? I've heard that it does not. If so that is a bit disappointing.

Now correct me if I'm wrong but does this seem right? I'm concerned about buying a system that pushes their own product/s (without proper disclosure - if indeed that is the case) given the negative experience I've had with AMA. Apparently the system doesn't go into any alternatives(?) so it perhaps might be useless to me.

Personally, I might not feel comfortable buying it on that basis. Can anyone shed any light on this as I hope that I am wrong.

 

[louis31]

It does use ama and they do own it although thats not an issue. This is probably just a front end product to pull people into ama.

What is more concerning is that they and Mark are showing sites that are "succesful" when in fact its obvious they are not. The posts had just gone up and one of them did not even have affiliate links on it despite it supposedly earning $250 a month. Really bites into their credability and ethics.

What were your problems with ama?

 

[jcdean]

What is AMA.
To me that meas American Motercycle Association.

 

[louis31]

I think it stands for article marketing automation, a way of getting your articles posted to a lot of 3rd party blogs

 

[bartko09]

What is more concerning is that they and Mark are showing sites that are "succesful" when in fact its obvious they are not. The posts had just gone up and one of them did not even have affiliate links on it despite it supposedly earning $250 a month. Really bites into their credability and ethics.

They've removed the post dates from their WP theme's and have now monetized the sites. They should be making $500 a month now! LOL!

 

[bartko09]

I think it stands for article marketing automation, a way of getting your articles posted to a lot of 3rd party blogs

Which brings me to a credibility issue here. Here's what AMA clams on their site:

In a recent poll (16th May 2009) of all articles in AMA we found that they ranked for their targeted keywords like this:

* 10% held a #1 Position
* 41% held a 1st Page Position
* 20% held a 2nd Page Position
* 10% held a 3rd Page Position
* 29% held a top 40-100 Position

Seeing how they're obviously claiming income on a site that wasn't even monetized, how can we be sure these numbers are accurate or even truthful?

 

[paulie69]

Sure, I haven't got a problem with the fact they endorse AMA but surely they should disclose their association with it and not just hard sell it as a completely independent product (if that's the case).

I don't want to get off topic here but when I was using AMA earlier this year (for several months) and asked support questions - all I got were terse, confused, unintelligible replies in broken english (typically not related whatsoever to what I asked - if I got an answer at all that is!). Others have had mixed experiences using it, some have apparently had great success and love it, others pretty much the same as me. Maybe by now the system and support is improved(?) If so, that's great.

It pays not to get too hung up on those issues and just move on. Although I got good at using AMA I just chalked it up to experience (or lack of experience on my part) aka let the buyer beware. :) I might use it again one day, who knows.

 

[louis31]

There lies the problem. I'm sick and tired of a lot of the big players lying to us.

I make my living as an affiliate marketer and an seo consultant and I used to believe these guru's. However the more you look into it they are willing to lie to get monetary gain. Really shocking and disappointing.

Probably only about 3 of them I would trust in the world!

 

[bartko09]

There lies the problem. I'm sick and tired of a lot of the big players lying to us.

I make my living as an affiliate marketer and an seo consultant and I used to believe these guru's. However the more you look into it they are willing to lie to get monetary gain. Really shocking and disappointing.

Probably only about 3 of them I would trust in the world!

Fake it till you make it. lol

Note from Mark: See my response and Daniel Turner's full response on page 3 of this thread. I'm all for freedom of speech, which is why no comments in this thread have been edited or anything, but I must let you know that there are no more trustworthy marketers that Marc and Daniel. I've met a lot of them and I do my utmost to protect my list from these guys. You have no idea how many run-ins with 'fake gurus' that I have had over the years and how many people's products that I turn down when their launches come around. I thought Marc and Daniel had a very good product - particularly for only $77. Regarding the income claims that this thread is about, firstly these are just 3 of their many websites, secondly, their staff were moving wordpress themes for their affiliate sites and it screwed up the links and the dates on the posts. If you check the whois records those sites have been around a year or two each.

 

[louis31]

Pailie what you soon learn is all these guys make over blown claims that are untrue.

Even Marc ling here claims to have a number of 7 figure a year affiliate businesses. When you look under the surface I doubt this is true.

This site may make 7 figures a year as an affiliate but his main other income comes from product creation rather than affiliate marketing. I believe most of his income comes from affiliates bringing him sales. Again no problem with this just wish they would not talk with forked tongue.

Note from Mark: I never claimed to have several 7 figure a year affiliate businesses. I have regularly claimed to have several 7 figure a year niche websites, and I have claimed to make over 7 figures a year in affiliate sales (this is combined over all my various websites). I made over 250k in affiliate commissions before I ever even put my first product online, which is one of the big reasons why I teach people to start with affiliate marketing, then move on to product development when you're ready. I own over 100 affiliate websites, they bring in great return, but the thing is, once any is making great money, I often launch a product in that niche, so of course I don't own 7 figure a year sites that solely do affiliate marketing although those product sites still make a lot of money in affiliate sales also

 

[louis31]

bart, you would expect and hope better from these guys.

 

[jcdean]

There lies the problem. I'm sick and tired of a lot of the big players lying to us.

I make my living as an affiliate marketer and an seo consultant and I used to believe these guru's. However the more you look into it they are willing to lie to get monetary gain. Really shocking and disappointing.

Probably only about 3 of them I would trust in the world!

Most Affiliate Marketers aren't any better, the internet is full of phoney reviews.

Curious about the three Gurus that you trust???

 

[paulie69]

Well, with respect guys, please don't infer anything on Mark. He has a heck of lot of respect around here and his honesty is impeccable. Mark and his staff have bent over backwards to help us all. Indeed Mark and his team have helped me personally as have a lot of other forum members. I am deeply in their gratitude. They go out of their way to do the right thing and you won't find better, more honest support anywhere on the web.

 

[louis31]

True about affiliate marketing although i only promote products I believe in which is why I do ok.

Three gurus I trust are Eben Pagan -more strategy than nitty gritty but excellent and no bs, plus he made his cash way from the make money niche

The other two are not gurus but seem like good guys. Matt Carter - marc lings friend but gives solid advice and practices what he preaches and gives value.

Joe Hughes - a UK guy, caters more for the newbie but seriously knows his stuff, helped me when I emailed him for no cost, really good advice. His site is business opportunities mentor, not many advanced strategies there but he knows themso if you get stuck you can email him and he will help. Bizerely he rarely sells anything and 90% of his reviews are negative (no fake reviews there).

I quite like Frank Kerns stuff as well, you know where you stand with him.

 

[louis31]

Paulie I guess you can't argue with that. I would just like more transparency rather than smoke and mirrirs.

The classic was with the blogging bootcamp, we never got to see any traffic for the site Marc built or any sales figures. How can we benchmark ourselves when Marc is too afriad to show the stats on his site.

 

[jcdean]

True about affiliate marketing although i only promote products I believe in which is why I do ok.

Three gurus I trust are Eben Pagan -more strategy than nitty gritty but excellent and no bs, plus he made his cash way from the make money niche

The other two are not gurus but seem like good guys. Matt Carter - marc lings friend but gives solid advice and practices what he preaches and gives value.

Joe Hughes - a UK guy, caters more for the newbie but seriously knows his stuff, helped me when I emailed him for no cost, really good advice. His site is business opportunities mentor, not many advanced strategies there but he knows themso if you get stuck you can email him and he will help. Bizerely he rarely sells anything and 90% of his reviews are negative (no fake reviews there).

I quite like Frank Kerns stuff as well, you know where you stand with him.

Jimmy D. Brown I trust.
Andrew Fox I admire, but don't trust so much. (Legendary Email Marketer)
Frank Kerns Intrigues me, wish I could afford his stuff.

 

[louis31]

Don't know Jimmy brown. The fox brothers are full of it!

 

[jcdean]

Don't know Jimmy brown. The fox brothers are full of it!

Didn't say they wern't.

I admire Ardrews success and how fast he acchieved it, starting from a PLR ebook about adsense. to 10,000 paydays from a push of the send button.

 

[louis31]

I always admire success as long as they tell the truth. Better get back to some link building! What niches are you in?

 

[jcdean]

I always admire success as long as they tell the truth. Better get back to some link building! What niches are you in?

I have jumped around alot. Makeing some money with micro niches and the ebay affiliate program. http://www.usmcknife.com

Not sure if I will be welcome here after I admit this but....
I am going into the make money online Niche. I have followed Andrew Fox, and Chriss McNeeny to the dark side. Sinse you know my secret now, tell me the truth, would this Website suck you into my funnel. I will be bidding on the term Affiliate Project X with it. http://www.clickbank-insider.com

(opt-in not added yet)

 

[louis31]

sorry missed this post I'll have a look now. Nothing wrong with the money making niche as long as you don't lie!

 

[louis31]

Clickbank bombshell copy is excellent did you write it yourself? I guess it depends on the cost per click, are you preselling affiliate x? From my experience you only get between one and two sales per 100 clicks.

Your copies really good so you may do better.

Let me know how you get on. Who did the report graphics?

Thanks

 

[louis31]

$1.50 a click pretty steap you will need a good conversion! You done anything like this before?

 

[jcdean]

Clickbank bombshell copy is excellent did you write it yourself? I guess it depends on the cost per click, are you preselling affiliate x? From my experience you only get between one and two sales per 100 clicks.

Your copies really good so you may do better.

Let me know how you get on. Who did the report graphics?

Thanks

I "borrowed" some of the copy from Day Job Killer. IMHO the best copy ever written, I hope Chris X dosn't mind sinse I am selling his stuff. There is a liitle of the Rich Jerk Style thrown in. The idea of having a cartoon logo came from the Rich Jerk also.

The graphics on the ebook are from http://www.topecovers.com

 

[louis31]

You have done a cracking job, I think you have a shot!

The URL for the ecover site is wrong by the way.

 

[sheepfarmer]

Although I do not use AMA and am not going to buy CWS in my opinion Daniel Turner & Marc Lindsay are both winners who do try to help people be successful. I did buy their outsource method and although it was a little expensive and I new a lot that was on it money well spent. His interviews and talking about the mental aspect are priceless as far as I am concerned. What I truely like about Daniel (I do not personally know the man) is his mindset and I believe he does care.

Remember we are all affiliate marketers here and we should be open minded. You can learn something from everybody.Not everybody is trying to stick it to you.

 

[louis31]

Shhepfarmer,

Hard to feel so generous when they say look at this site it has made $250 a month consistently, only to find the site has just gone up and there are no affiliate links on it.

Unless there is another explanation (I can't think of one) they are deliberetly misleading us!

Not cool.

 

[jcdean]

$1.50 a click pretty steap you will need a good conversion! You done anything like this before?

First time, I hope to get good conversions. When They Opt-in they will go straight to APX with my hoplink. If they don't buy then I can try again. When they double opt-in from the email from the thank you page I am going to offer a killer bonus to Join APX with my link, if they haven't already. I am going to try one more time from the pages of the ebook.

The cool thing is that they will be on my list, I can try to sell them stuff for years.

I am thinking I can out bid the phoney review sites and the direct-linkers, becuase I am building a list. and have severl chances to sell for the cost of one click.

Soon Mark Ling will be doing seminars with me! O.K. I am getting carried away.

The other thing I got going is the fact that I registered affiliateprojectx.org. Traffic Travis tells me that ranking for affiliate project x is do-able. so I can send free traffic to the same funnel.

Any way I am following what I learned by watching the Gurus. For example Travffic Travis cost a bundle to be given away for free, but it put me on Mark's List, so Traffic Travis probably paid for itself 100 time over by now. I have bought from Mark twice.

Anyway back to world domination!

P.S. if you like a good irony, the ebook is about what I just said here. Stealing costomer lists from the gurus, useing their brand to make money. Like a coffee table book about coffee tables.

P.S.S. Don't try to save me, I am so far down the dark path that there is no hope for me.

 

[louis31]

Enjoy the dark side let me know how you get on.

 

[jcdean]

The URL for the ecover site is wrong by the way.

Fixed it.

 

[louis31]

Cheers appreciate it, best of luck. May money rain down on you!

 

[idleme125]

Are we seriously to believe that the internet has our best interests in mind? These guys basically sell one anothers "systems" as affiliates and selling to us on their lists. Mark should have taken some time from his success and checked this so called product. Its full of holes and its just really a loss-leader to get you to buy that AMA stuff. I stopped being a premium member last month because the blogging bootcamp was never updated with current stats, etc. The premium memberships selling point was the bootcamp training but Mark failed to follow-through completely. This is like the wild west, get the money anyway you can, nobodys looking and hurry up before the law steps in (if ever) and tries to clean this up.

 

[louis31]

idleme I agree with a lot of what you say, especially about the blogging bootcamp I cancelled my membership months ago when I was told they would not be doing the catchup webinar as promised.

I think you can make money with physical products I'm just not convinced these guys are actually doing it.

 

[michellerana]

According to Marc Lindsay, these sites were in the process of being moved from one format to another and by moving and reposting the posts it makes it look as though they were posted today when they have in fact been online for a while longer than that. You can see how long these sites have been around for by checking their whois records.

They are fixing that date thing up right now. We passed the message on and they said to say thanks for pointing it out.

 

[MarkLing]

I thought the websites were cool examples, but I added an 's' to one of the urls by accident, and also they were in the middle of switching wordpress themes at the time and it stuffed up their links.

So I received a lot of complaints from people, both on the affilorama forum here and in our support system. As people believed that the income claims were false.

I find it a real shame that that happened because there are a lot of untrustworthy people online, and Marc and Daniel are not among them. I get shown products by different internet marketers almost every day. I turn down almost every product that I'm asked to promote.

I thought they'd put together a really good product with no fluff or 'filler' to pad it out. They charged a really low price for it so lots of people can get into this, I even passed their product on to one of my relatives who wanted to give this a go (as 3 hours to build a website is about all her attention span would allow so I thought it was a good match).

Now this has been blown out of all proportion. Most people will only read the first page of this thread and think that it is a scam or something, when really it was a simple muck up by Marc and Daniel's staff when they were switching their wordpress theme over (plus my mistake in the spelling). Other than that it's a great wee system they've got going there. I know others doing a similar thing with good success too.

 

[MarkLing]

Regarding the bootcamp, I did have the catch up webinar, I had a couple of them. The recording failed on the 2nd one.

Although to say that is the main selling point of premium is surprising to me, it was a bonus, not the main part of the product.

We've invested thousands and thousands into the premium members software, hosting, plr articles, and I am currently working extremely hard on upgrading all the issues of the magazine part also, I'm not going to do a big launch of the new edition when it comes, but it will be even better than ever before. Premium is a constant work in progress that me and a number of my staff are always working hard on to bring the best information, affiliate software tools, plr content and behind the scenes videos.

I will record another catch up bootcamp webinar though, I do apologize for the recording failing, that was totally my fault. You can see that there are a lot of high seo rankings for that website from the bootcamp though when you do some google searches, and I can show the income on a catchup webinar. I'll mail premium members about the date of that next week.

Mark

 

[DanielTurner]

Hiya Louis (and everyone else here who have brought all this up)

Marc summed up a lot of what I would have posted in the WF thread (i'll paste it here for you)

Hey All,

PearsonBrown, I appreciate your point of view mate, your welcome to a free copy please pm me your email and I'll get access setup for you.

We've turned all of our things around from the start of this year actually and it's been great guns, just required some restructuring in business process and staffing but its awesome and I'm loving every second talking with our awesome awesome members.

Guys.... This is for anyone who has been struggling for years and for some reason cant tie it together.

It is Basics.... but its VERY SPECIFIC, no fluff, and no filler.

Anyone who has read Rework will know exactly what I am on about, do not expect latest this latest that.

Its what works, in the quickest possible format and nothing else.

I am proud we did not fill it with bs, it could have been tripple the size.... but what would that achieve?

Confuse you 3 x as more?

Bloat is over valued, it's not about the size its the end result you achieve with what you learn.

If you want advanced.... I can deliver it too you... But it wont be in a $77 ebook.

TechSmith | Screencast.com, online video sharing, 2010-06-18_0059

1 site.... 1 of 6 analytics accounts.....

But lets be honest.... If your starting out you will not achieve the above screenshot.... that's why you don't see outlandish bs on our copy.

It's real.... It's life changing to those that implemented it and have implemented it.

sneak peak behind the scenes.

CWS Blog Go listen to Susan's story, there are many many more just like it.

If you want to feel like you've read through 80 pages of fluff or some "crazy new name for something you'll probably never use"

Don't buy please, you'll waste your time that you could spend better elsewhere like reading here.

If you've "read it all for free here in the warriorforum" and still your not making anything online.... Then your missing something.

It's like picking up a good book, you follow an Author, most sci-fi is the same model, just told differently, some people click with different author's.

The difference? I think we've got the skills to show we practice what we preach in many many many ways.

When I can help our internal members, and people like Susan who have never made a sale before in their life..... its pretty darn special to me and I enjoy every moment of it.

Hopefully I can do the same with you too.

Other than the copy above.... there are 10 free copies for warrior members, first ones to post here and claim, then pm me your email I'll have em to you tomorrow.

Cheers
Marc

Now, as for the specific questions:

Louis31:
"I just watched Marks latest video about the CWS which I am interested in however the sites they showed just do not add up!

They say this site earns $250 a month http://antiaginglifeextensions.com/ however there are no affiliate links on the site! Exactly the same with the third site it shows.

Also these sites posts are only from june 2010 so how have they earned that cash for months as claimed?"

I said to Mark Ling this morning it was probably stupid of us to do so but we changed over to a new install/setup - it also meant for things like the photo sites we had URLs that were ranking #1 that were still going to 404s and Ling actually picked it up before the video he did... the point is, we still make mistakes and bugger stuff up as much as the next guy but don't take that as lies or deceit.

jcdean:
"The buisness model really is full proof.

None of what I just said makes it OK to make phoney claims though."

This is why we've set it up the way we did, there is no breakthroughs or amazing technology, just what works. We've always prided ourselves on not BS'ing people in results or copy, only showing sites or stats that are 100% true to the method we're promoting (I'm kicking myself that we made the changes we did now but at the end of the day, we still improve our sites continuously... sometimes for the better, sometimes stuff breaks)

Ok, I have to head off but as soon as I get back I'll keep replying and answering the other questions/concerns here:

Daniel

 

[wollowra]

Hi Everyone,
Daniel Thanks for posting.
Mark thanks for clarifying some things as well.

Now, I feel compelled to have my say.

Guys and Gals, if you see something online that seems to not make sense at the time or you think it looks dodgy, then sure be cautious. However, my suggestion is don't go off on a hot headed rampage accusing people of this or that before you give it a bit of time and get the facts first.

The internet can be very impersonal at times and sometimes it is hard to convey certain ideas, results, methods etc..
Mark does his best to provide everyone with real value.
I have been online for a while and boy have I seen some dodgy marketers.
However, Mark simply is not one of them.
He would never try to pull the wool over anyone's eyes in my opinion and I can only go on past experience and the way he goes about his marketing.

He has the right to promote whatever he feels would provide some good value to people.
No one is twisting your arm to buy anything or sign up to 100 Guru email lists etc.

They stuffed up! So what!

Have you ever done something and then thought to yourself, why on earth did I do that for?

Sometimes, things happen online that do not go to plan. Servers crash, links get broken and typo's happen.
If something stuffs up it does not mean that it is a scam or someone is lying to you.
Yes it does happen where people are trying to scam you and that is life, but at least give everyone the benefit of the doubt and some time to sort things out or rectify a problem before calling something a scam or in this case saying people have just made stuff up and in Mark's case his past track record shows he deserves at least some respect and be given the benefit of the doubt.

If you can not handle hickups online or hit the unsubscribe button, then you are in the wrong business.

I don't want to offend anyone here and that isn't my intention but some people just need to take a deep breath before they do or say things.

I know it can be frustrating at times online and I can certainly see different points of view that people may have.

@louis - Please don't take offense but If you respect Matt Carter then ask him about Mark or Daniel and see what his opinion of them is. I think you will find he speaks of them highly.


Just my 2 cents.

P.S I am not paid to be a mod here and I do this on my own time to help people out.
No one told me to post here.
If anyone takes offense to what I have said above I apologize in advance.

 

[paulie69]

Thanks Troy, well said... my sentiments exactly :)

Well said Marc and Daniel too by the way...

Daniel if there are any copies left could I please claim one? I'm a Warrior member.I can't PM you directly from WM because I have < 50 posts so far. Otherwise I'm more than happy to buy and maybe give AMA another shot :)

Regards
Paul.

 

[louis31]

Hi the two Marc's and the moderator.

First off I did not go off on a rampage. First I sent a support question to affilorama and left a comment on the CWS blog with my email address asking them to explain. I also did not head this thread CWS Scam or anything sensational.

I got one less than satisfactory response for affilorama. Seems strange that all 3 sites were moved over to a new theme at the same time. In internet marketing it pays to be cynical.

I appreciate things go wrong and I just wanted an explanation.

As an aside I bought the system despite this and did not ask for a refund.

I hope on their live calls they show some sites that are making money.

WhatI do appreciate is both of the guys coming on here and explaining there position.

Regarding the premium membership the bootcamp was definetly the pull to join. I sent two report questions asking for an update and was told and I quote "Marc does not think it's neccessary and the bootcamp has now finished". I even told them that this was the reason I stopped my membership.
I guess we have put this to bed now.

Thanks

Louis

 

[wollowra]

Hey Louis,
Like I said I do not want to offend anyone but I felt that your post was a little one sided and negative saying that people made stuff up. Did they? well that depends if you believe what Daniel said.
But Mark trusts these guys and that is enough for me.
I can understand your skepticism and caution but I feel you did not give them time to explain properly.
Anyway, let's all move forward hey.

Kind Regards
Troy

 

[Centered]

Is it recommended to get the upgraded version for $67/month as well? Will appreciate the answer.
Thanks much!

 

[elink]

When it comes to online business Mark Ling is the real deal. I have reverse engineered his business model and researched all his network of websites. He does make money from what he teaches us in Affilorama and Affiloblueprint. Dont sleep on Mark, he has changed my online biz game. Kudos Mark!!